Lloyd Harrison Whitling's WebSite, THE NAKED TRUTH.

 

 

 

From http://www.atheistlloyd.com/Debunking/PRobertson.html

Dear Pat Robertson:                                                       SML165  Hit Counter

Honesty is the first chapter of the Book of Wisdom.

Thomas Jefferson (1743-1826, 3rd American President)
 

The expression, "as crooked as a Republican preacher" must surely apply to the likes of Pat Robertson and now deceased Jerry Falwell, who have perverted the GOP to promote their own ends. That these two people, and others like them such as Ann coulter, Rush Limbaugh and more, have not been sued for libel and slander by the innocent human beings they earn their living by demonizing makes me wonder if there's something wrong with our legal system, or if their victims are as spineless as these people claim.

This is from http://www.patrobertson.com/speeches/JeffersonianIdeals.asp , wherein Mister Robertson attempts to live up to his intentions, entitled, "Restore America to its Jeffersonian Ideals.  Mister Robertson has never bothered to display himself as an honest man, but has often shown himself adept at use of very creative 'facts' presented to audiences who will never bother to question his veracity or his sources, when they do exist. Some quotes attributed to Tom Jefferson were never expressed, are not part of the contents to which he attributes them, or were written in language with inherent meanings different from Robertson's revisionist  restatements.

America's hedonist 'Jeffersonian ideals' were many times the opposite of what the ilk of Pat Robertson would ply upon our nation. An important example, given here to show how perverse are such claims, is the Principle of Natural Innocence that flies in the face of religions' credo that all are guilty, that begins at birth and persists until forgiveness has been gained. Natural Innocence is a well-established secular principle that says the opposite: that all are innocent until proved guilty. With that as a start, the reasons the United States was not founded as a Xian nation (in spite of what it has become due to the encroachment of Xianity) could easily fill a book.

    I will take the liberty to intermix my own comments within his words below. My own work will be inset like this paragraph, and will be in this color serif type. Mister Robertson's text is crap-colored, sans serif (like this example), and left at full width.

He begins with a synopsis:

Synopsis: The Jefferson Memorial pledge on the "altar of God (of) eternal enmity against every form of tyranny over the mind of man" challenges Americans today. Governments can cause tyranny, a welfare state can cause tyranny, and political correctness creates tyranny. Pat calls for freedom for believers to pursue their faith, freedom from undue government regulation and a restoration of Jeffersonian defense of God-given liberties.

Actually, religions (and other self-centered interests) cause tyranny and use government as a tool, as has been your self-expressed interest. Large corporations introduce tyranny into churches and government and many people have shown good reason to believe those are what Mister Robertson refers to as "God". Believers do already own the freedom to pursue their faith, as many Christians fully realize, for so long as religion and government are kept separate. The earliest settlers of our country fought hard to avoid being victims of religious intolerance. Today, Mister Robertson attempts to manipulate and rewrite their words to further the reinstatement of tyranny into the minds of their heirs in spite of warnings they gave against allowing this to occur.

UNIVERSITY OF VIRGINIA, March 3, 2000 -- This evening, I think back to one of the most profound experiences of my life when for the first time I entered the Jefferson Memorial in Washington, looked up at the statue of that incredibly handsome and powerful man, and then I read his words chiseled in the marble frieze surrounding the ceiling: "I have sworn on the altar of God eternal enmity against every form of tyranny over the mind of man."

These words stirred something visceral within me, and I repeat them: "I have sworn upon the altar of God eternal enmity against every form of tyranny over the mind of man."

Has anybody bothered to check this "quote"? I have found it attributed to him, but without its context. It would have been good of this man to have included a picture of the inscription for us all to read, and to have supported his claim of it being a Jefferson quote by providing source information. Lack of that leaves it very suspect to those of us who doubt Mister Robertson's honesty and intentions. The quote may easily have originated in the construction of the memorial and, knowing Jefferson to have been a Deist, it most likely was not from him.

Still, it has been verified as such at one site: http://www.bookrags.com/wiki/Jefferson_Memorial#Inscriptions but I have found it nowhere else attributed with actual source materials.

Deism is not at all Xianity like Pat Robertson professes. In the Deist belief, God created it all, then sat back to watch it play itself out in a profound kind of boredom relieving game. Jefferson's own peers reviled him to as an atheist. Were he to actually utter that expression, it would be as a metaphor, and not as something inherent to his own ideals.

Jefferson played unique role
Ladies and Gentlemen, unless you understand these words, you do not understand this great genius who played such a key role in shaping the United States of America.

Listen to what else Jefferson said. A pessimist is Pat RobertsonIn the Virginia Statute of Religious Freedom he wrote, "Almighty God has created the mind free." In a letter to George Washington, he wrote, "God who gave us life, gave us liberty. "In the Declaration of Independence, he wrote, "We hold these truths to be self-evident that all men are created equal; that they are endowed by their Creator with certain inalienable rights, that among these are life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness."

Mister Robertson has fabricated the information regarding the letter and the statute from misinformation which can be found in Christian literature but not in anything Jefferson wrote. The 'Creator' referred to in the Declaration of Independence is the Deist God, who supposedly created the universe and then left it to fend for itself (according to Deism). The term is found in the Declaration because that document took aim at British tyranny, which included the Church of England and the imposition of that against the colonists.

Ladies and Gentlemen, tonight I stand before you as a Jeffersonian Conservative, and as such, I share his hatred of any form of tyranny over the minds of men, be it Communism, be it Fascism, be it Socialism, be it the over-bearing liberal welfare state, or be it the stultifying political correctness that has reached out to stifle freedom of expression on countless college and university campuses across America.

Mister Robertson reaches far and wide, and away beyond government to include tyranny being perpetrated upon us. And yet, in his obfuscation against political correctness, he overlooks all the ways he benefits from that: "It is not nice to say nasty things about people like Mister Robertson, even while they feel free to say nasty things about you."  Actually, Tom Jefferson often expressed his feelings against the threat of tyranny that came, then and still, from the Christian leaders. If Mister Robertson actually felt the way he declares himself to, he would be preaching instead against the way his regime attempts to control scientific information in practice, and in the educational system that should be attempting to prepare American youth to become the good and knowledgeable leaders of the future.

We must be free to question
I believe that men and women should have the freedom to explore truth, to question pedagogical orthodoxy, to speak out on any side of an issue, and above all, to be free from the current crop of liberal thought police who permit only those forms of speech which agree with their view of reality.

Of course, since my days at Yale Law School in the 1950's, all the way to the Presidential election of 2000, I have learned a sobering truth. Those who call themselves "liberal" are not liberal at all. They want government control of business, government control of labor, government control of education, higher government taxes on the people, government control of families, and most of all, they want, in their own hands, control of the flow of thoughts and ideas that are disseminated to the people.

There is nothing "liberal" about them. They are elitist -- convinced that they and their associates are the sole possessors of enlightenment and truth needed to lead all others.

 Wow! Does he overlook that it is those who share his viewpoint that want those things? Why do the RRRR people want to place their idols and graven images all over any bare and empty places in our governmental edifices? Answer: "Because we need to be kept reminded of our country's roots in the Bible." That our country was not rooted in the Bible is beside the point, but lies will be told to avoid the truth: That our country was founded in avoidance of the Bible and those who pound on it to emphasize their theological pronouncements.

For my own thoughts on "liberal", look here.

Jefferson on 20th century liberals?
How would Thomas Jefferson have regarded these 21st Century "liberals"?

Christianity neither is, nor ever was, a part of the common law,” Thomas Jefferson, letter to Dr. Thomas Cooper, February 10, 1814

These self-proclaimed liberals, who, in the matter of human life, permit full and favorable discussion of a woman's right to choose abortion, but castigate and deny expression to those who wish to plead for the rights of the unborn?

Who denies Mister Robertson his freedom of speech? His own brain does little to control his own speech! How can he justify right to freedom and life for the unborn, and still support the right to murder and imprison them later by performing postpartum abortion on them as adults? If, according to his stated beliefs, the innocent infants automatically go to Heaven and the adults end up in Hell (as will those who murder either one), to whom is he doing a favor by forcing them to be born into the lives of squalor, misery, and crime that he sees as being the choice they will freely make for themselves in spite of all odds and circumstances prevailing against them?

Who, in the matter of human sexuality, insist that taxpayers support promiscuity, pay for illegitimacy, advertise condom use and distribution, but file lawsuits to deny the teaching of abstinence and traditional marriage for young people?

Would it not seem correct to suppose that a God who created Nature and saw it to be good would want things to remain as natural as possible? I suppose, though, that is not the reason Mister Robertson is against the use of condoms by young people. He also overlooks that more than half of the taxpayers are, themselves, promiscuous, as has been discovered about a goodly number of his fellow preachers.

If "traditional marriage" is what Mister Robertson insists upon, then I, who have remained blissfully wed to my original mate for almost half a century, am about three marriages too late for my first divorce.

These liberals, who in the matter of politics accept all segments of society to participate in the political process except the 100 million members of society who are Evangelical Christians and pro-family Roman Catholics.

If Mister Robertson meant to say 'expect' instead of 'accept', maybe his sentence can be interpreted. His numbers are away off, and he had to include Catholics to bring them up to a meaningful amount. Even at that, the bottom line will be closer to sixty million than to his hundred; and at that, a large portion of those belong to congregations that despise his fanatical brand of religion. Around 15 million would be a more honest assessment.

What he really ought to present here is examples and references to his sources so we can all be sure he has not just made all of this up. I have heard of no one at all (except his Dominionist Rightwing Extremist associates) attempting to keep Catholics or anyone else from legitimate engagement in the political processes of our country.

And if you think that assessment is overstated, please consider the fact that on Monday of this week, there was a misguided attempt to humiliate certain Virginians of religious faith in order to deny them and the candidate they supported the access to those privileges of citizenship which all Americans should enjoy as a matter of course.

Okay. Finally, an actual example for all these claims. Is it a real example, or one that he made up? The default position is the latter, for so long as references are not provided. Hyperlinks are very easy to include on a web page, and I feel sure that anybody wearing Mister Robertson's questionable shoes would want others to see to what he has referred IF it really exists.

Or, he should stand down, the actual sentiment he makes apparent he rails against.

Believers disenfranchised?
I am not talking here about the free discussion of ideas on their merit. I am not talking about heated debate in the vital marketplace of a free people. I am talking about the mind-set of those who say simply that the deeply held beliefs of people of faith are not worthy of discussion, and therefore those who hold them should be stigmatized, ridiculed, and suppressed.

Well, thank you for feeling that way, Mister Robertson. I feel sure I will not be the only atheist who might regard you with a percentage or two of higher respect for standing up for us that way. I believe in myself, and I believe in my own ability to reason from scientific evidence and verifiable factual matter, and find my way to the factual truths that bear upon my existence and the existence of all humanity, and I appreciate your support from the bottom of my heart.

I must, however, gain some kind of understanding of your support also being for discussion and heated debate of meritless ideas. Is it because a lot of people don't seem to understand how enforcing meritless concepts wastes a lot of time and money that could better serve humanity by replacing them with programs developed from ideas which do show merit? Are you trying to foster discussions about them so people will gain more exposure to the truth?

As I stand before you tonight, I am pleased to report that the people of Virginia still cherish the ideals of Jefferson, and on Tuesday repudiated a call for divisiveness and intolerance.

Ah, yes, the Virginia people again. I am left to wonder what it's all about.

But what of the vast nation we call America? Does this nation still cherish the Jeffersonian ideal of freedom? You be the judge.

In Texas, the former Democratic Attorney General said and I quote, " The state owns your children and it owns you too."

Ah, yes, the same link he gave for the people of Virginia. Default position remains unchanged. All I can find about Jefferson and Virginia points to this: In reply to an address to him by a committee of the Danbury Baptist Association (8 id. 113), took occasion to say: 'Believing with you that religion is a matter which lies solely between man and his God; that he owes account to none other for his faith or his worship; that the legislative powers of the government reach actions only, and not opinions,-I contemplate with sovereign reverence that act of the whole American people which declared that their legislature should 'make no law respecting an establishment of religion or prohibiting the free exercise thereof,' thus building a wall of separation between church and State. Adhering to this expression of the supreme will of the nation in behalf of the rights of conscience, I shall see with sincere satisfaction the progress of those sentiments which tend to restore man to all his natural rights, convinced he has no natural right in opposition to his social duties.'

When our Republic was founded, there were only three federal crimes under the Constitution. From then to now, Washington has created over 3,000 federal crimes. New federal regulations restricting our freedom in some way total 60,000 pages a year. Under The Health Care Proposals advocated in 1993 by the President and Senatorial Candidate Hillary Clinton, ordinary citizens and their physicians could have become a new criminal class-threatened with heavy fines and prison sentences merely for seeking life-saving medical care outside of a government mandated health alliance.

Ah, yes, the same link he gave for the people of Virginia. Default position remains unchanged.

Taxes and regulations on the rise
In the name of improving our lives, political liberals controlling the federal government have raised the taxes on the average American family to a level that exceeds the tribute paid by serfs in Medieval Europe. These same liberals have given us the IRS, the SEC, the EPA, the NLRB, the FEC, the FCC, the EEOC, the ICC, and the ATF, plus an alphabet soup of federal departments and agencies which along with the Justice Department have the power to intimidate, harass, bankrupt, fine, or imprison virtually every citizen of this nation. Why do we now have 3,000 federal crimes? Why were there at least 70 criminal sanctions in a plan designed to give us better health care? The answer is simple. Political liberals want utopian governmental solutions for all of society's problems. And if the ordinary people don't buy their far-out schemes, let the government declare that ordinary people are criminals.

Ah, yes, the same link he gave for the people of Virginia. Default position remains unchanged. Actually, under the theocratic government Mister Robertson supports (remember Orwell's 1984?), things would be a lot worse. There might only be one crime, though, which would be to disagree with Mister Robertson.

About taxation: Much of the alphabet soup attributed to so-called 'liberals' has originated in Mister Robertson's own camp. Many of the so-called 'crimes' are from violation of laws originated and conceived by those who share his own agenda. Books have been written about that. And, as for taxes: How does it benefit the average American Family when rich folks' taxes are reduced while poor folks pay taxes through the purchase of double-priced fuel to support a warfare agenda that has been well and often demonstrated itself to have been contrived to support an obscene barrage of lies?

"Tax Relief" is a lie unsupported by the facts, and should be renamed "Investment Avoidance" in consideration of those fine folks who run corporations that take their American-produced wealth away from the American people and leave us holding the bag for infrastructure expenses while they invest the capital our system helped them earn into systems that will—and heartily do—compete against us. That is outright theft of wealth gained from those who already made their investments into America by those who now cheat against reinvesting to support the origins of their own riches. Taxes are the dues we owe for membership into the most fantastic social organization in the world, and America's common folk must soon awaken to realize who it is that shirks their dues and so allows the club to fall apart in decay while they roll in the gains acquired from betraying the American trust.

Listen to the words of Jefferson, "To compel a man to furnish contributions of money for the propagation of opinions which he disbelieves and abhors, is sinful and tyrannical."

I don't know if Jefferson actually said that, because the man did not give the source of this quote; and so, even though the default position must remain the same, I will acknowledge it sounds like it agrees with Jefferson's position in general.  Let's look at it in the context of Jefferson's actual circumstances and accomplishments, and make sure we keep on track with a correct understanding of it.

The opinions about which Jefferson would have expressed such condemnation are those of the Christian religion, which Jefferson stated himself to be very much against on repeated occasions. That same religion, in its most fanatical form, through Dominionism and Reconstructionism, is right now attempting to accomplish that which Jefferson warned us against, and let me quote,      "The hocus-pocus phantasm of a God, like another Cerberus, with one body and three heads, had its birth and growth in the blood of thousands and thousands of martyrs"-- Thomas Jefferson (Works, Vol. iv., p. 360)-- a quote that refers to the Trinity of Christianity; and:
      "And the day will come when the mystical generation of Jesus, by the supreme being as his father in the womb of a Virgin Mary, will be classed with the fable of the generation of Minerva in the brain of Jupiter.... But we may hope that the dawn of reason and freedom of thought in these United States will do away [with] all this artificial scaffolding."--(Thomas Jefferson, letter to John Adams, 11 April 1823--; and, in
1801:
    
"I have examined all the known superstitions of the word, and I do not find in our particular superstition of Christianity one redeeming feature. They are all alike founded on fables and mythology. Millions of innocent men, women and children, since the introduction of Christianity, have been burnt, tortured, fined and imprisoned." --Thomas Jefferson, third President of the USA, letter to William Short.-- 
    And, finally, now that its context is plain:
"In the fevered state of our country, no good can ever result from any attempt to set one of these fiery zealots to rights, either in fact or principle. They are determined as to the facts they will believe, and the opinions on which they will act. Get by them, therefore, as you would by an angry bull; it is not for a man of sense to dispute the road with such an animal." Thomas Jefferson (1743-1826, 3rd American President)

Let's restore Jeffersonian ideals
Ladies and Gentlemen, I submit to you tonight that the time has come in America for those who cherish the ideals of Thomas Jefferson to rise up and assert our God-given liberties and reject a continuation of the tyrannical rule of the Radical Left and their liberal allies.

Never forget: While pointing the finger of accusation at innocent people, the remaining fingers point back at yourself. Jefferson plainly stated our liberties to be derived from human consent, not god-granted from a scheme he expressed constant doubts about. Look here:  "Our principles [are] founded on the immovable basis of equal right and reason." -- Thomas Jefferson, to James Sullivan, 1797. ME 9:379 -- That may not be enough to convince the most obtuse readers. Here is:
     
"On the dogmas of religion, as distinguished from moral principles, all mankind, from the beginning of the world to this day, have been quarreling, fighting, burning and torturing one another, for abstractions unintelligible to themselves and to all others, and absolutely beyond the comprehension of the human mind." -- Thomas Jefferson, to Carey, 1816 --

Hear again, "I have sworn upon the altar of God eternal enmity against every form of tyranny over the minds of man." Then consider the liberal assault on our children and their teachers: In Salinas, California seven years go, Lindsay Freeman, a five-year old was asked by her kindergarten teacher to sing her favorite song in front of the class. Lindsay reports that when she started signing "Jesus Loves Me This I Know...," the teacher stopped her, saying "I'm sorry Lindsay, you can't sing that song here." Then she sent Lindsay to her chair, and told her to put her head down. Lindsay says she felt hurt and angry that she was being "punished" for singing her favorite song!

Ah, Mister Robertson, where is your source material? That teacher has no basis granted to her to say that. None!

In San Antonio, Texas, a 52-year old Grandmother was handcuffed, arrested, and stripped searched three times for the crime of passing out pro-life literature on a public sidewalk and street outside of a high school.

This has an appearance of heavy exaggeration, but it is about Texas. We have no idea if the story is true, nor about its context. It being Texas, it elicits pictures of firing a shotgun into the air, and old lady getting into a violent argument after picking a fight with a police officer, and all kinds of crazy probabilities. The default position, without verification is: "It didn't happen."

Micah Lynn Harbison, a second-grader in Bakersfield, California, was told by her teacher to bring a picture of her "hero" to school. When Micah Lynn brought a picture of Jesus riding a white horse, the teacher pulled her aside and told her that she could not have Jesus as her hero. Later, when her father asked the teacher why, the teacher said that the assignment asked for a "living" hero and then proceeded to tell him that her photo violated the "separation of church and state."

Separation of church and state is a Jeffersonian principle and is what your document here purports to be upholding. Beyond that, your own favorite reference book asserts that the Jesus character died and ascended into Heaven. Beyond that, the default position, without verification, still is: "It didn't happen."

When Jason Bishop of Lebanon, Pennsylvania, took out his pocket Bible to read during free reading time at school, he was told by his teacher that his activity was "illegal" and that he should put his Bible away. Only a threatened lawsuit restored to Jason his constitutional rights.

In this example, if it actually did occur, the teacher was in the wrong. Only activities initiated by authority figures are in violation of the Jeffersonian principle of separation of church and state, and it has to be plainly just as wrong for a student's non-disruptive activity, even if it involves religion, to be thwarted. It makes no difference whether it is a Bible, a Quran, a Book of Mormon, or Bertrand Russell's "Why I am Not a Christian," the teacher would have been in the wrong if the student was, in general, behaving.

ADLJ seeks to restore these ideals
Decades ago, I resolved to say no to tyranny, but my resolve did not take the form I desired until nine years ago when I founded the American Center for Law and Justice to go into the courts of America to fight the ACLU and their allies of the Radical Left.

Since then, we have fought the tyranny of America's "thought police" in virtually every major jurisdiction, and I am pleased to report that from the Supreme Court of the United States on down, we have never lost one case! In 1998, the Center received over 102,000 complaints primarily from students or their parents outlining attempts by public schools to deny them their constitutional freedoms.

We give a tyrannical school or school system 24 hours to correct abuses, or we bring action against them in Federal Court. At present, we have over 1,000 active cases, and could bring 85 federal lawsuits against school districts demanding that they accord fundamental free speech rights to children with religious faith. Next month, our chief counsel will argue in the U.S. Supreme Court for the simple freedom of a high school football team in Texas to say a student-initiated voluntary prayer before a game.

If student-initiated activities are what you are defending in every case, then bully for you. I remember public schools in my own youth: We were marched to "Religious Education" classes at a church chosen by our parents, and exposed to the Christian mythology first hand under the guise of authority from the state. Those were not student-initiated activities, and none of the churches involved were of my parents' beliefs. What I learned from the resultant disputes with my teachers, and with my parents, was that I had to find out for myself what must be true. As a result, enforced lessons in Christianity taught me to be an atheist.

Mr. Jefferson spoke of "enmity against tyranny over the mind." These school officials haven't seen enmity against tyranny until they face-off in a federal court against our Chief Counsel, Jay Sekulow, and try to justify their actions.

But this brief discourse would be incomplete if I failed to emphasize one facet of the writings of Jefferson which the Radical Left has studiously ignored.

Freedom comes from God
Every statement that Jefferson made about freedom carried with it his clear understanding that the right to freedom for every man and woman does not come from government; it does not come from social position; it does not come from wealth; it does not come from intellectual attainment. No …Freedom comes from the direct creative act of a sovereign God.

In our country, even the "radical left" is to the right of center.

Jefferson actually said rights were granted by consent of the governed. If you will read your Bible, you will someday observe that the 'laws' presented in there are not about rights and prevention of governmental tyranny, but are the exact opposite as statements of rules, requirements, and obligations wherein no rights or freedoms are allowed.

Jefferson said, in fact, that this truth in his day was "self-evident." To George Washington, Thomas Jefferson, James Madison, John Adams, Patrick Henry, in fact, to all of the Founders of this great nation, religious faith was the indispensable support of all of the liberties of a free people. As John Adams put it when the Constitution was drafted, " This constitution will serve only a moral and a religious people. It is totally inadequate for any other."

Liar, bald-faced and plain!

"We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable rights, that among these are Life, Liberty, and the Pursuit of Happiness..." We are familiar with this phrase from our  Declaration of Independence, but have we considered its logical implications and outworking? Probably not, because we are too inclined to simply take what's been handed to us. In my own mind, the "creator" is nature and none other, as that is the only source of existence and life for all of us.
     First, please realize this message to the King of England had no intentions of being anything more than a statement of our intentions to secede from our role as a British colony.  The King's position also made him head of the Church of England, a fact that provided reason enough for including a renouncement of enforced superstition within this same document. Second, Jefferson's Deism gave him a picture of a God that was nothing like Christianity's God, but more like that of Pantheism (wherein Nature and God are one and the same). Were I to renounce atheism, the Pantheist view I would adopt would allow for the same expression as the Deist view Jefferson openly upheld, without the misrepresentation proffered by the Christians against whom Jefferson openly set himself. That he referred to natural rights (that is, rights inherent to Nature) in the quote at the beginning section of this document also supports that.

In a letter to George Washington, Jefferson wrote, " Can the liberties of a nation, be preserved when we have removed a conviction that these liberties are the gift of God? Indeed I tremble for my country," he continued, "when I reflect that God is just, and His justice cannot sleep forever." Indeed, I tremble for my country when I realize that the Radical Left has for decades systematically excised from our nation's consciousness virtually every vestige of the historic faith of the Founders of this nation.

Even atheists openly sympathize with the expression that Nature's rules and laws must be obeyed, and that Nature gives or withholds all according to the conditions extant. That anyone could interpret and uphold Jefferson's words more readily with this Pantheist view than with the Christian is only a matter of comparing that which is obvious against that which has to be assumed.
    But still, that does not deal with your misrepresentation of Jefferson's words as shown away from their contextual setting. Jefferson did champion the separation of religion and government (or, in his words, church and state) He championed the removal of the conviction and, in stating so, worried that the RRRR of the day were going to rise up and terrorize the populace with their fanatical promulgations.
     So, saying "God is just", a Deistic expression in support of Yin and Yang, or a Pantheist's expression of concern for the balances inherent to the proper workings of Nature, does not make Mister Jefferson into anything other than the Deist he claimed to be.

A moral lobotomy
In the words of former United States Attorney General Bill Barr, the liberals have performed a "moral lobotomy" on the public schools of America.

The consequences are predictable. We are engulfed in a tidal wave of broken families, illegitimacy, drug abuse, alcoholism, murder, rape, school shootings, and spiraling health care costs -- all of which are rapidly eroding the freedoms we have so long taken for granted. But tonight, there is hope. What the political left has taken away, we can recapture. You are the heirs of Thomas Jefferson. You study at the University he founded. You honor his memory.

Let me challenge you tonight to let his words move you to action. Fight for freedom. Fight against tyranny. With God's help, work to bring about a rebirth of the Jeffersonian ideal in this nation.

I cannot argue against this, except to doubt who is at fault. Broken families result directly from poverty and ignorance, two conditions Christianity openly idealizes. The Bible itself almost opens with a statement against the acquisition of knowledge and that gets perpetuated throughout both testaments. The original Christian church, the Catholics that Constantine created out of Mithraism, burned books to prevent the spread of knowledge by demonizing it as heresy, and those who sought to spread it anyways were destroyed as heretics. In our own country, to this day, science has to fight an ongoing battle to keep its own evolving knowledge from falling victim to the evils of paranoid fanaticism.
     How strange it must seem to any outsiders how those who fight against the promotion of awareness and knowledge about science's discoveries, use the tools that result from that as weapons in their fight to demonize science and scientists, and to cast doubt on scientific warnings about the effects some of our profitable activities will have on our environment, and endanger the welfare of future generations.
    So, I feel glad that you so completely support people like me in our ongoing fight for freedom that we never really had, freedom against the effects of evil greed from the dues-evading cheaters who use all kinds of charades to avoid paying their fair share of our reinvestment in America; freedom against the misnamed "Putrid Sky Act" which undid years of sky-clearing regulations to allow unhampered pollution by super-wealthy corporations that saves them money to build their new plants elsewhere that no controls exist; the "No Tree Left Behind Act" that is so named because clear-cut forests get converted from healthy trees to useless brush piles that become fire hazards; the "Let's Use Up Our Own Oil While They Still Have Plenty Left Act", pushed by people on both sides of the fence who don't like having to choke up as much as half the price Europeans pay for fuel to chug their guzzling SUVs down city streets one person at a time; or "Wipe Out Education Now" which so strictures our schools not only with reduced funds opposite to that promised, but removes funds from public education to channel it to agenda-based private education, while demonizing public schools for not doing so well as they choke to death in the midst of right-wing efforts to raise smoke screens of blame. Otherwise known as the "Poor Kids Left Behind Act", it punishes students who go to poorly performing schools by making sure those schools do even worse.
     The phrase 'Compassionate Conservative' elicits a laughable image (really!) of someone who crushes your head with a single blow from a silver mallet to render you unconscious before he steals all your belongings, in order to not offend you while he's doing it. Conservatives are people who hate change, and come out from their caves only long enough to gripe about the world and vote against any signs of progress. Compassionate Conservatives are willing to share their caves with you. For a fee, of course.
     Guess who supports the 'Poison Water Bill', as a part of the RRRR agenda to get rid of so-called 'Liberals', most of whom live in areas  susceptible to pollution of all kinds. The 'Let's Expose Social Security to Corporate Greed Bill' is a perpetual hot item on the RRRR agenda, as are all the items related to 'Let's Keep Love Out of Families' programs, the 'Let's Weaken America So We Can Take It Before The Muslims Get it' programs that seek to lay the blame on everything wrong onto everybody but the real culprits. And last, but not least, the recently passed 'Let's Drive Americans Out of Their Homes and Onto the Streets Act' that recently passed. We will soon have our freedoms, of the kind supported by the likes of Mister Robertson, in which we can wander all over the place in search of food and shelter.
     I'm sure we can figure out how to blame it onto the so-called 'Liberals' while everything falls into place.

See you at the gas pumps. What do you say after you've sneezed and blown snot all over everybody?

Thank you and God bless you.

Right… Enjoy the pollution, Bob. The Bible you claim to live by has a message just for you and those you support with your mischief: From the 23rd Chapter of Matthew:

23:1 Then Jesus said to the crowds and to his disciples:

2 "The teachers of the law and the Pharisees sit in Moses' seat.

3 So you must obey them and do everything they tell you. But do not do what they do, for they do not practice what they preach.

4 They tie up heavy loads and put them on men's shoulders, but they themselves are not willing to lift a finger to move them.

5 "Everything they do is done for men to see: They make their phylacteries wide and the tassels on their garments long;

6 they love the place of honor at banquets and the most important seats in the synagogues;

7 they love to be greeted in the marketplaces and to have men call them `Rabbi.'

8 "But you are not to be called `Rabbi,' for you have only one Master and you are all brothers.

9 And do not call anyone on earth `father,' for you have one Father, and he is in heaven.

10 Nor are you to be called `teacher,' for you have one Teacher, the Christ.

11 The greatest among you will be your servant.

12 For whoever exalts himself will be humbled, and whoever humbles himself will be exalted.

13 "Woe to you, teachers of the law and Pharisees, you hypocrites! You shut the kingdom of heaven in men's faces. You yourselves do not enter, nor will you let those enter who are trying to.

15 "Woe to you, teachers of the law and Pharisees, you hypocrites! You travel over land and sea to win a single convert, and when he becomes one, you make him twice as much a son of hell as you are.

16 "Woe to you, blind guides! You say, `If anyone swears by the temple, it means nothing; but if anyone swears by the gold of the temple, he is bound by his oath.'

17 You blind fools! Which is greater: the gold, or the temple that makes the gold sacred?

18 You also say, `If anyone swears by the altar, it means nothing; but if anyone swears by the gift on it, he is bound by his oath.'

19 You blind men! Which is greater: the gift, or the altar that makes the gift sacred?

20 Therefore, he who swears by the altar swears by it and by everything on it.

21 And he who swears by the temple swears by it and by the one who dwells in it.

22 And he who swears by heaven swears by God's throne and by the one who sits on it.

23 "Woe to you, teachers of the law and Pharisees, you hypocrites! You give a tenth of your spices--mint, dill and cummin. But you have neglected the more important matters of the law--justice, mercy and faithfulness. You should have practiced the latter, without neglecting the former.

24 You blind guides! You strain out a gnat but swallow a camel.

25 "Woe to you, teachers of the law and Pharisees, you hypocrites! You clean the outside of the cup and dish, but inside they are full of greed and self-indulgence.

26 Blind Pharisee! First clean the inside of the cup and dish, and then the outside also will be clean.

27 "Woe to you, teachers of the law and Pharisees, you hypocrites! You are like whitewashed tombs, which look beautiful on the outside but on the inside are full of dead men's bones and everything unclean.

28 In the same way, on the outside you appear to people as righteous but on the inside you are full of hypocrisy and wickedness.

29 "Woe to you, teachers of the law and Pharisees, you hypocrites! You build tombs for the prophets and decorate the graves of the righteous.

30 And you say, `If we had lived in the days of our forefathers, we would not have taken part with them in shedding the blood of the prophets.'

31 So you testify against yourselves that you are the descendants of those who murdered the prophets.

32 Fill up, then, the measure of the sin of your forefathers!

33 "You snakes! You brood of vipers! How will you escape being condemned to hell?

34 Therefore I am sending you prophets and wise men and teachers. Some of them you will kill and crucify; others you will flog in your synagogues and pursue from town to town.

35 And so upon you will come all the righteous blood that has been shed on earth, from the blood of righteous Abel to the blood of Zechariah son of Berekiah, whom you murdered between the temple and the altar.

36 I tell you the truth, all this will come upon this generation.

37 "O Jerusalem, Jerusalem, you who kill the prophets and stone those sent to you, how often I have longed to gather your children together, as a hen gathers her chicks under her wings, but you were not willing.

38 Look, your house is left to you desolate.

39 For I tell you, you will not see me again until you say, `Blessed is he who comes in the name of the Lord'.

We may be atheists you claim to be at war against. We may be secularists, progressives, or liberals. "Let he who is without sin cast the first stone." That stone has been tossed by your side, Mister Robertson. My NIV Bible and my King James agree with me and those on my side: You had no right to judge us. You had no right to toss it at us. You have no right to complain if we toss it back.

What is Mister Robinson's hidden agenda, as shared with others of his kind?

Look here for answers: http://candst.tripod.com/index.html

For more on the Founding Fathers' beliefs: http://monotheism.us/ . One thing that's important about attributions ("Who said what and when") is to provide references, something people like Mister Robinson seldom do. It is easy to claim somebody said something. It is harder to provide proof by citing source materials. It is impossible to prove something if it's a lie to start with, and a lot of Founding Fathers arguments and Intelligent Design arguments include quotes from sources long ago discredited.  For more about this, look here.

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